# Interesting Article **URL:** \ **Category:** BKP Private Forums\ **Created:** [October 26, 2005, 10:44pm UTC](http://bkp-society.com/t/interesting-article/333 "2005-10-26T22:44:34Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 14\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![system](http://bkp-society.com/images/discourse-logo-sketch-small.png) [@system](http://bkp-society.com/u/system)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2005, 10:44pm UTC](http://bkp-society.com/t/interesting-article/333/1 "2005-10-26T22:44:34Z")
[By arQon](http://www.esreality.com/?a=post&id=916377) ---
**Author:** ![ScrotcH](http://bkp-society.com/user_avatar/bkp-society.com/scrotch/32/27_2.png) [@ScrotcH](http://bkp-society.com/u/ScrotcH)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2005, 11:26pm UTC](http://bkp-society.com/t/interesting-article/333/2 "2005-10-26T23:26:41Z")
fan boi ---
**Author:** ![system](http://bkp-society.com/images/discourse-logo-sketch-small.png) [@system](http://bkp-society.com/u/system)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2005, 11:47pm UTC](http://bkp-society.com/t/interesting-article/333/3 "2005-10-26T23:47:42Z")
Well he does make some good points there. ---
**Author:** ![stas](http://bkp-society.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/s/3e96dc/32.png) [@stas](http://bkp-society.com/u/stas)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2005, 12:26am UTC](http://bkp-society.com/t/interesting-article/333/4 "2005-10-27T00:26:00Z")
I don;t agree with the idea. ---
**Author:** ![system](http://bkp-society.com/images/discourse-logo-sketch-small.png) [@system](http://bkp-society.com/u/system)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2005, 1:05am UTC](http://bkp-society.com/t/interesting-article/333/5 "2005-10-27T01:05:47Z")
Read the comments. ---
**Author:** ![system](http://bkp-society.com/images/discourse-logo-sketch-small.png) [@system](http://bkp-society.com/u/system)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2005, 1:15am UTC](http://bkp-society.com/t/interesting-article/333/6 "2005-10-27T01:15:40Z")
Just emailed him, saying we should maybe have a meeting on irc and discuss the whole thing with other mod teams. I’ll keep you updated. ---
**Author:** ![system](http://bkp-society.com/images/discourse-logo-sketch-small.png) [@system](http://bkp-society.com/u/system)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2005, 12:51pm UTC](http://bkp-society.com/t/interesting-article/333/7 "2005-10-27T12:51:43Z")
Here’s what he said.. From arQon The point is NOT to make everything public. It’s to make ASSETS public so that not only do we maintain a common look and feel across all Q4 mods, we do so with the BEST possible look and feel. Open-sourcing all the CODE used by every mod is DEstructive: the only thing THAT leads to is everyone and their dog copying it, renaming it to “MY 1337 MOD!”, and a glut of clones appearing all over the place making it impossible to play where you want without having to download 80MB of “16 copies of the same mod with different names”. I’d like to include certain pieces of code at SOME point in the future (“standard” bugfixes etc) but they need a more suitable license for that to happen anyway, which is currently waiting on id/Raven. ---
**Author:** ![DragonMage](http://bkp-society.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/d/8c91f0/32.png) [@DragonMage](http://bkp-society.com/u/DragonMage)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2005, 8:26pm UTC](http://bkp-society.com/t/interesting-article/333/8 "2005-10-27T20:26:30Z")
All it sounds like is that he wants a ton of recognition for everyone using his menu system/PM skins in their mods. If this guy’s true intent is to help the Quake community, why was he such a dickhead about giving stas the PM skins code? It just doesn’t make sense. ---
**Author:** ![stas](http://bkp-society.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/s/3e96dc/32.png) [@stas](http://bkp-society.com/u/stas)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2005, 12:16am UTC](http://bkp-society.com/t/interesting-article/333/9 "2005-10-28T00:16:37Z")
I still don’t see why we should participate in this. If he doesn’t want to open up code, then what’s the point? Share texture packs and .map files? Plus the whole idea of the common look across all the mods is really bothering me. It sounds like someone trying to get his work in every mod out there. ---
**Author:** ![system](http://bkp-society.com/images/discourse-logo-sketch-small.png) [@system](http://bkp-society.com/u/system)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2005, 12:26am UTC](http://bkp-society.com/t/interesting-article/333/10 "2005-10-28T00:26:38Z")
I think the point is so that average newb that maybe downloads a new mod only to find out all the commands are different than other mods he plays. He says fuck it and deletes the mod because he doesn’t want to learn everything all over again. It wouldn’t be every mod out there in on this, but a few if they combined a little bit of what they do all together could better everyone’s mod. I think that’s his point. ---
**Author:** ![stas](http://bkp-society.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/s/3e96dc/32.png) [@stas](http://bkp-society.com/u/stas)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2005, 12:29am UTC](http://bkp-society.com/t/interesting-article/333/11 "2005-10-28T00:29:07Z")
Ok. So we could all come up with some standards regarding console commands and customization in general. That is fine. But leave implementation up to the mods. ---
**Author:** ![system](http://bkp-society.com/images/discourse-logo-sketch-small.png) [@system](http://bkp-society.com/u/system)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2005, 1:06am UTC](http://bkp-society.com/t/interesting-article/333/12 "2005-10-28T01:06:08Z")
> [@stas](#): > > Ok. So we could all come up with some standards regarding console commands and customization in general. That is fine. But leave implementation up to the mods. exactly, but if another mod liked something from your mod you could help them out with it, for example - another mod likes your hud, they could implement it into their mod with your help but your not limited to that hud, just like in jb you have multiple hud choices. ---
**Author:** ![DragonMage](http://bkp-society.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/d/8c91f0/32.png) [@DragonMage](http://bkp-society.com/u/DragonMage)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2005, 1:31am UTC](http://bkp-society.com/t/interesting-article/333/13 "2005-10-28T01:31:23Z")
> [@xterm](#): > > > [@stas](#): > > > > Ok. So we could all come up with some standards regarding console commands and customization in general. That is fine. But leave implementation up to the mods. > > exactly, but if another mod liked something from your mod you could help them out with it, for example - another mod likes your hud, they could implement it into their mod with your help but your not limited to that hud, just like in jb you have multiple hud choices. This sounds like it will promote laziness and kill innovation if mod developers simply wait to be handed a nice looking HUD that everyone else is using. Not to mention, if you genuinely wanted to help someone out with implementing your HUD, you don’t need this stupid system to do it. You simply help them implement it. As I and stas have already said, it just sounds like this guy wants to get his work out as everywhere he can. It’s transparent really. He’s being selfish under the guise of helping the beloved Quake community. ---
**Author:** ![system](http://bkp-society.com/images/discourse-logo-sketch-small.png) [@system](http://bkp-society.com/u/system)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2005, 2:03am UTC](http://bkp-society.com/t/interesting-article/333/14 "2005-10-28T02:03:02Z")
> [@DragonMage](#): > > > [@xterm](#): > > > > > [@stas](#): > > > > > > Ok. So we could all come up with some standards regarding console commands and customization in general. That is fine. But leave implementation up to the mods. > > > > exactly, but if another mod liked something from your mod you could help them out with it, for example - another mod likes your hud, they could implement it into their mod with your help but your not limited to that hud, just like in jb you have multiple hud choices. > > This sounds like it will promote laziness and kill innovation if mod developers simply wait to be handed a nice looking HUD that everyone else is using. Not to mention, if you genuinely wanted to help someone out with implementing your HUD, you don’t need this stupid system to do it. You simply help them implement it. > > As I and stas have already said, it just sounds like this guy wants to get his work out as everywhere he can. It’s transparent really. He’s being selfish under the guise of helping the beloved Quake community. I disagree, almost every mod out there has asked him for things he made. ie netcode, pm models, ect… cpma has the best q3 netcode ever made. 100 ping feels like 40 in cpma. His point is “I think” Let all the mods work together and implement the “hard” code. Such as this, he’s willing to release some of his coding if other mods will release some of theirs. Combine everything together into a standard. Doesn’t mean you can’t do your own stuff. This “coding” would not be available to everyone. Just the mod teams who make a decision to work together and help each other out. Kind of a trust type of thing.